Alternative to pet loot change for combating summon farming

Discussion in 'Feedback' started by Chonky, Apr 9, 2020.

  1. Chonky
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    Chonky Donator

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    So I've recently made a bm and have noticed a minor problem in that when grinding, my summon will sometimes kill mobs, resulting in me having to manually loot the drops. While this is only a minor inconvenience, I'm of the opinion that a fix for a bug/exploit should never come at the expense of legit players. So I'd like to present an alternative:

    Make summons stop attacking if the player has not attacked within the last 10-20 seconds. This should be doable as it would be similar to how summons don't attack when the player is mounted.

    Even after the pet change, tons of people are still afk summon farming, and just coming back every 2 min. or so to loot the items. This change would actually be more effective at combating the issue without causing any inconvenience to other players.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2020
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  2. Shiyui
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    My question is: why is summon farming even an issue?

    The reasoning given for why pets no longer loot mobs killed by summons was to mitigate botting. Which is silly since the vast majority of botters I always found were "manually" attacking anyway. But I digress.

    What I question is why summon farming is something you seem to want to eliminate. If you are concerned about maps available for Heartsopper farming, there are literally 60 maps available. 20 channels, 3 maps: Sophilia's Bedroom, Toy Room, and Piano Room. Surely not all 60 maps are taken so you can freely farm the drops if you wished.
     
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  3. Chonky
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    Chonky Donator

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    I personally don't have particularly strong feelings toward summon farming, but the general consensus is that it's unhealthy for the game and is borderline botting, since you only actually play maybe 5-10 seconds every 2 min. while still getting the same benefits as someone who was actually actively killing them.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2020
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  4. Shiyui
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    I don't see a general consensus that summon farming is unhealthy for the game. Granted, I'm an old player, so sure my perspective is very different from that of a new player. But even so, I think I can objectively say that summon farming is actually healthy for the playerbase. The most affordable standard attack potion are Heartstoppers, which generally cost 400k-450k each. The bulk of the supply in the market is due to summon farming. Eliminate summon farming and Heartstopper prices go up, causing boss runs to incur higher upfront costs, either by acquiescing to increased Heartstopper prices or resorting to Onyx Apples. Unless people switch to Warrior Elixirs, which is unlikely, especially for new, weaker players who don't have the base damage to compensate.

    I can see the perspective that summon farming is botting, but the fact is it's not. And as far as the idea that summon farmers get the same benefit of someone who actively kills the same mobs simply isn't true. Summon farming Heartstoppers is 50% as effective as active killing, based on my tests of an average 35 Hearstoppers per hour, which I have tested on multiple occasions back when I summon farmed both Voodoos and Psycho Jacks on 7 characters at a time.
     
  5. Evan
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    Because some people took it well and far beyond a normal reasonable amount. lol

    It's sort of like the reporter who abused LL Beans lifetime warranty to get his (still good) boots replaced every year which resulted in the warranty being revoked for everyone.

    I like your idea because it hurts regular players less but I think would also make it quite a bit easier to mass summon farm, as instead of having to sit and loot whatever gets killed (which can take some time), attacking once takes a fraction of a second.
     
  6. Chonky
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    People would still be able to multiclient at voodoos, it would just involve cycling through the clients more actively. As for the price of heartstoppers rising, there are many ways that can be mitigated, such as increasing the drop rate from voodoos or adding them to the drop table of other mobs, such as HH, BF, and/or CWK mobs.
    But the main issue I have is the solution that was implemented with pet loot interfering with regular players. My aim is more to get that change reverted rather than put a stop to summon farming.

    True, I didn't really consider that aspect. I guess the amount of delay before the summon stops attacking would be important in regards to how many clients someone would be able to keep up. For instance, if the delay were only 5 seconds, then it would be very difficult to keep up more than around 4-5 clients at a time without starting to lose uptime on the summons. It would definitely require some thought in regards to how low the delay could be made without interfering with the average player.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2020
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  7. MaiAh
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    alt tab summon click was to broken...
    sadly instead of nerfing/limiting extreme multiclienting we got summon-pet loot nerf that become annoying for normal class with summon to farm/grind/leech
    even at the peak of alt tab summon click farming "abuse" era there was players that were threatening to make 15-20+ clients to farm lol
    (some actually did )

    i've said early on ulu that mutliclient farming it's issue and again instead of nerfing clients we all just got map nerf and expensive pots
    and still players continue to push the extreme multiclient farming

    sure it's okie to multiclient but must be limit when it comes to farming, just like voteing and all other limits each content has
    we need to keep the game balance ,healthy and fun
    oh well.. it's private server and as RMS team want
     
    Last edited: May 16, 2020
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  8. ImagineWagons
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    From what I've read in this thread so far it would seem that the issue of multiclienting is what really should be addressed rather than summon farming.
    I've done my fair share of farming at Voodoos and Psycho Jacks and can confirm that the numbers that Shiyui said are correct. Per hour you get around 35-40 Heartstoppers per hour on average for each map.
    This totals out to around 20M an hour if we're being generous with HeartStopper prices (500K per). Literally farming ULU 1 or 2 for an hour and NPC'ing the drops will net you greater gains, so IMO heartstopper farming is really negligible economically.

    Summon farming really only becomes an issue when you're doing it with multiple characters since the 20M stacks up per map. Instead of nerfing the skill, I feel like addressing the core issue of multiclienting summon farmers is a better direction for balancing.
     

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